[Mediawiki-i18n] Fwd: [Wikitech-l] Fwd: Chat about MLEB

Bjoern Hassler bjohas+mw at gmail.com
Tue Jan 6 15:59:40 UTC 2015

Hi all,

many thanks!

>> My question is: If you are going from one translated page (e.g. base page
>> in en, translated page in fr) to another page (in en) that has a
>> translation for the same language (fr), can you automatically stay in this
>> language? I.e. if you on [[A/fr]] you click on [[B]], can are you
>> automatically taken to [[B/fr]]?
> Yes. Have you read the "Links" row in https://www.mediawiki.org/
> wiki/Help:Extension:Translate/Page_translation_
> administration#Markup_examples ? If it's not clear enough, please let us
> know. MediaWiki's assumption is that the French-speaking user of your
> example would also like to have the interface in French and to always read
> pages in French whenever possible.
I think that's our assumption too. Let assume the wiki is in en. If the
users selects fr as their interface language, and clicks on a link
[[page]], will they see the content of [[page/fr]] (if it exists)?

That's not clear to me from the above text ("If the target page is (or
should be) also translatable, you should link to it by prepending
Special:MyLanguage/ to its title. Only the link label will need to be
translated, because this automatically redirects users to the translation
page in their own interface language, as selected for instance via the
UniversalLanguageSelector. However, to achieve a constant behavior the
syntax must be used for all links.")

>> Our resource is quite complex (e.g. extensive use of templates, and
>> semantic mediawiki) see
>> http://oer.educ.cam.ac.uk/wiki/OER4Schools - would somebody with MLEB
>> experience be happy to have a chat to see whether MLEB is the right tool?
> I'm extremely interested in hearing of your use case (an OER wiki), the
> more you tell us about it the merrier!

Thanks! Let me explain some more. Have a look at
http://oer.educ.cam.ac.uk/wiki/OER4Schools/versions to see what we are
trying to do. E.g. the heading reads:
Idea D: Planning for a trip to the game reserves and Victoria Falls[Z]
<http://oer.educ.cam.ac.uk/wiki/OER4Schools/Zambia>Masaai Mara[K]
<http://oer.educ.cam.ac.uk/wiki/OER4Schools/Kenya>Akagera National Park[R]
<http://oer.educ.cam.ac.uk/wiki/OER4Schools/Rwanda>Outamba-Kilimi National
Park[S] <http://oer.educ.cam.ac.uk/wiki/OER4Schools/Sierra_Leone>

and we'd consider a page like [[.../vesions]] to be part of our "master
version" that shows all variations. They are all English language but the
superscripts mean:

Z = en, localised for Zambia
K = en, localised for Kenya
and similar for Rwanda, Sierra Leone.

The differences really aren't to do with language, but to do with local
educational variations (such as slightly different education systems;
different policies, different challenges, etc). The difference between
en-Zambia and en-Kenya is probably about 5% or less I would guess.

To make it more complicated, we might soon have two versions for Zambia.
The programme may be varied by different organisations, and we might have
en-Zambia-UNZA and en-Zambia-Nkhana or similar (UNZA and Nkhana academy
being HE institutions).

 At the moment, we haven't implemented display of localised versions
yet. Our current thinking is as follows. By way of example, each page has a
main version, and a participant version,
where the "pv" version only has one template on it, called
{{includeparent}}, which includes the parent page. On the main page
[[Group_work_Same_task_and_different_tasks_group_work]] there is basic wiki
text, but also templates, such as {{ednote}}, which check the page title,
and does not produce content on (sub-)pages called pv.

We were thinking of extending this to cover localisations. I.e. we were
thinking of just maintaining one page
[[Group_work_Same_task_and_different_tasks_group_work]], that contains
localisations produced with {{Zambia|Victoria Falls}}{{Kenya|Masaai Mara}}
etc, where those templates only produce content on specific pages, such as
which only contain a single template "{{includeparent}}".

It's a bit cumbersome, especially because all the 'zm', 'ke', 'rw' (as well
as 'zm/pv', 'ke/pv', 'rw/pv') need to be created manually (for each
basepage). Then again, that's mainly an issue for the wiki administrators
(and I suppose it could be automated), while the adaptation of text for
users is simple. One advantage is that the basepage can be edited freely,
without upsetting the translations.

I'd basically like to work out whether we'd be better off switching to
using the translate extension, or stick with the our home grown ideas.
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